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Hi,

about two months ago, I bought 4 old junipers in tree nursery shop. Tey all have nice and fat trunk, and they all geting some backbudding.

I am attaching some photos of one of them. Can anybody suggest me, what is the next step with shaping it into bonsai. Do I let it grow for a longer time, or I can already cut some brunches. Juniper is exactly like I bought it in nusery shop. Only backbudding is new.

I was thinking about cutting of the botom brunch? Or not?

That''s an ugly juniper. You should give it to me.

You've got a couple of good things going on:
- Nice base! Good tapering.
- Backbudding. You're going to need that.

This is going to be a (very) long term project (but I guess you expected that).
I would:
- be very careful with the new foliage on the trunk, and new foliage on branches close to the trunk
- Not yet cut the lower branches; the tree needs the foliage to get energy
- Maybe cut two, three of the higher branches

Next I'd let it grow, and let the new foliage develop. I'd fertilize heavily (not too much though, don't kill it )
Other branches can be cut later.

Auk wrote: That''s an ugly juniper. You should give it to me.

:whistle:

I've bought 4 of them. Only 20 EUR/each. They are similar, but on my oppinion the one I posted pictures of, has the most potential. I am aware, there will be a lot of time needed to grow and evolve. For some reason in nursery shop removed most of foliage, and left it only at the end of brunches. I did not do anything yet. I will porbably cut of one or two brunches with the less backbudding to force more foliage on the other brunches. Or is it beter to leave it like this?

I'll also add some fertilize. I heave some BIO stuff for my garden. It's imposible to overdose

Mercnik wrote: For some reason in nursery shop removed most of foliage, and left it only at the end of brunches.

Probably they were intended to be or to become pom-pom style garden 'bonsai'.

Or is it beter to leave it like this?

I think what you write makes sense - remove some to get the new foliage to grow faster.

do not remove foliage. it backbuds on strong growing branches, not weak! so fertilize and give sun. only cut once you have a good mass of foliage closer to the trunk. only remove branches you really do not need for your design

O.K. here is what I think... Beginner here.

Now, trying to be realistic. It is obvious the only strength of this Juniper is its thick trunk. I feel what everyone is suggesting would make you wait too many years. To my understanding, you have to wait too long if you want backbudding on a Juniper. A nice Juniper does not need to have foliage close to the trunk, this is nonsense. I don't know why people keep repeating this over and over. Yes traditional Junipers do have a lot of foliage close to the trunk, but this is not a necessity. "You've got what you got" and I would try and go with the nature of the tree. African style trees, or "literati style", or trees that grow on a very dense forest tend to have most, if not all of their foliage at the top. So why not go with the true nature of the tree? You'll get a nice looking juniper much faster.
Look at this example:



So with wiring, and working on getting good ramification at the top to give the impression of the tree can give you a nice looking juniper in a few years, rather than waiting forever for back-budding... Your tree already has decent taper on the trunk, and decent ramification at the top. I think the problem is the trunk is bent, but you can straighten it up slowly if you would like. And all those other branches, leave them there, and eventually you'll create jin and shari. Honestly, I don't see why not go with the tree's nature, it is ugly now, but I do see potential, and waiting for back-budding seems like an extreme waste of time, and trying to transform the tree on what it is not.

Good advice already given by the guys before, maybe you wanna leave the branches to become a Jin in the future.

eangola wrote: O.K. here is what I think... Beginner here.

. A nice Juniper does not need to have foliage close to the trunk, this is nonsense. I don't know why people keep repeating this over and over. Yes traditional Junipers do have a lot of foliage close to the trunk, but this is not a necessity.

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:ohmy: How do you think this tree will look in about 5 years, if you don't work on the foliage close to the trunk?
you will need some form of backbudding if want to keep it in shape. otherwise you will have to make endless bends to keep it in shape, And the look will not be very natural, most seen with the species Picea. :whistle:

Orlando wrote:

eangola wrote: O.K. here is what I think... Beginner here.

. A nice Juniper does not need to have foliage close to the trunk, this is nonsense. I don't know why people keep repeating this over and over. Yes traditional Junipers do have a lot of foliage close to the trunk, but this is not a necessity.

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:ohmy: How do you think this tree will look in about 5 years, if you don't work on the foliage close to the trunk?
you will need some form of backbudding if want to keep it in shape. otherwise you will have to make endless bends to keep it in shape, And the look will not be very natural, most seen with the species Picea. :whistle:

I see your point. I was just trying to argue foliage close to the trunk is not a necessity. But I see, the taper, the shape of the trunk, the ramification detail needed for a world class Bunjin is absurd. I've seen some decent Bunjin style junipers with bent trunks, and not such advanced ramification, so I still think it is possible. I think what I would do if this was my tree would be to follow advice given here. Just let the tree grow, and see how it back buds. Top growth can be let growth, and periodically prune long shoots to work on ramification, without touching lower branches or lower growth. Once the tree looks better, and top growth looks more organized and ramified it might be more clear what the best path is. Right now the tree seems to be all over the place. And yes I agree I wouldn't try to straighten the tree, it is off the charts.

What do you think?

Image ending on 251 is the one which shows you the future tree. All other branches will eventually have to be removed and yinned, once you have enough foliage mass to support the tree. So focus on good growth there. Once you have some 10 cm extensions from the buds that you see on that picture, it is time to slowy start reducing the branches.

What you would get is a solid base, with good movement and young branches to be wired into place.

As you can imagine, I have a different attitude than some, and do not see bonsai as a sprint, aimed at getting a reasonable result as soon as possible, but more as a marathon, where over a long time you set an impressive result.